Author Topic: Chapter 97 RAW  (Read 27199 times)

Offline Kittykat

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #45 on: January 04, 2018, 11:15:51 PM »

In fact he has just broken Komaken without knowing what would happen to Rin. He doesn't know even if his brother could die bc of this, and instead of being worried he just joins the bad crew.
Satan broke Koumaken, not Yukio.
And he still doesn't mind if this kills Rin, he just takes off before knowing if he's okey.

He just shot his brother. It’s more like he expects him to recover.

Offline chinonamida

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #46 on: January 04, 2018, 11:34:28 PM »

In fact he has just broken Komaken without knowing what would happen to Rin. He doesn't know even if his brother could die bc of this, and instead of being worried he just joins the bad crew.
Satan broke Koumaken, not Yukio.
And he still doesn't mind if this kills Rin, he just takes off before knowing if he's okey.
Well he says : "I don't know what will happen when I go to the Illuminati. I might die too. In the unlikely event that (literally "a probability of one against ten thousand") we both survive, I will definitely become stronger than you."

So he knows Rin might die. If not from the broken sword, maybe from the order.

But Rin is surrounded by friends, leaving or staying might not make much of a difference in his chance of survival.

And he cares whether Rin survives or not. If he dies, who will he show off his strength to?

Offline Taytronics7

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #47 on: January 04, 2018, 11:44:31 PM »

In fact he has just broken Komaken without knowing what would happen to Rin. He doesn't know even if his brother could die bc of this, and instead of being worried he just joins the bad crew.
Satan broke Koumaken, not Yukio.
And he still doesn't mind if this kills Rin, he just takes off before knowing if he's okey.
And he cares whether Rin survives or not. If he dies, who will he show off his strength to?
Shiemi? Lol

But seriously, they're both going to live, and I hope we get a serious fight before they reconcile.

Offline chinonamida

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #48 on: January 04, 2018, 11:46:41 PM »
But seriously, they're both going to live, and I hope we get a serious fight before they reconcile.
Yeah. Pretty much.

Offline Karen

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #49 on: January 05, 2018, 03:57:46 AM »
:'( Sadly, weather or not Rin & Yukio both survive, I think it's way to late for any kind of reconciliation now that we know Yukio only really cares about power and knowledge for himself, that and being better than Rin. Katou wouldn't be able to do it without looking like she's pulling it out of thin air.

Offline spicychickendeluxe

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #50 on: January 05, 2018, 04:23:44 AM »
I still believe there will be reconciliation, kind of. Like said many times before, it'll be rough before that happens. 

Offline earthforge

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #51 on: January 05, 2018, 06:11:00 AM »
Well he says : "I don't know what will happen when I go to the Illuminati. I might die too. In the unlikely event that (literally "a probability of one against ten thousand") we both survive, I will definitely become stronger than you."

So he knows Rin might die. If not from the broken sword, maybe from the order.

But Rin is surrounded by friends, leaving or staying might not make much of a difference in his chance of survival.

And he cares whether Rin survives or not. If he dies, who will he show off his strength to?

Oy vey. I could rationalize Yukio's "just die" from chapter 2 as an an expression of grief, since he kinda lost both his dad and his "human" brother in one night. But between this "yeah, you might die, I might as well, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make" and how Yukio has no visible reaction to Satan gleefully announces his plan to take Rin's body, I think it's safe to say that Yukio is completely disconnected from Rin. He doesn't feel a thing right now towards Rin, not love, not even anger. His regard for Rin is nothing but twisted shallow admiration.

But... I think this is how he really has felt for some time. And it explains a lot. His reactions to Rin have never struck me as someone close, but as someone estranged reacting to shadows.

:'( Sadly, weather or not Rin & Yukio both survive, I think it's way to late for any kind of reconciliation now that we know Yukio only really cares about power and knowledge for himself, that and being better than Rin. Katou wouldn't be able to do it without looking like she's pulling it out of thin air.

I still believe there will be reconciliation, kind of. Like said many times before, it'll be rough before that happens. 

Yeah, this is gonna be tough to repair but not impossible. Yukio's demeanor on the helicopter isn't that of someone comfortable with what they've done. More like someone rationalizing. He doesn't necessarily regret, because there is no point, he can't unbreak Kurikara. What's done is done, and as far as he's concerned, the best thing he can do is remove himself from Rin and Shiemi's life. That way he won't keep hurting them. (Of course, it doesn't dawn on him that he could make up for it by helping, because he thinks himself fundamentally incapable of that.)

Given how Yukio pushed back Lucifer's flowery speech about world peace and won't get fried for it, to say nothing of how the Illuminati's tact with Yukio has been to push him to accept & be open about who he is, I'm thinking he'll be granted more latitude inside the Illuminati. Contrasts with the Order keeping Rin on a tight leash. It'd be interesting to see what he does with that freedom. I kinda wonder if his adversarial nature will lead him to clash with orders. Somewhat ironic if their blind encouragement of his darker side leads him to rebel against them.
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Offline SKL

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #52 on: January 05, 2018, 07:00:21 AM »
^Yeah Yukio has more latitude in the Illuminati than I originally thought. I knew they gave him an invite on presumed flexible terms so he wouldn't come in at Shima-level treatment at the very least.

But for Yukio to walk around like he's in charge and to talk like that to Lucifer...
He gets more latitude than I expected because he's pretty much walking around with Satan. There's Amaimon's behavior when he kicked Shiemi 'Don't get in Father's way', and Lucifer's 'My gratitude for bringing Father to me'. With Satan there, Yukio has a presence the demon kings have to defer to.

Offline earthforge

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #53 on: January 05, 2018, 07:43:13 AM »
^ The demon kings except for Samael. Mephisto knows what's going on and gives zero fucks. Probably because Satan is happy with him right now, since Samael is appearing to hold up his end of the bargain in training Rin so Rin's body can handle the flames. I wonder when Mephisto will break that agreement, because I'm pretty sure that he wants Rin as his own weapon to destroy Lucifer and Satan.

(Huge A flying warship with tons of weapons though... should we be worried?)

Yes. Yes we should. I'm pretty sure Katou saw Captain America Winter Soldier.

Anyway, just a random (not negative) thought about this chapter. Reading it again and staring at Yukio's bandage over his eye, I got suddenly reminded of Yukio's glasses solo pic from Kato-sama as a Happy Holidays artwork. GUYS (and GALS): I know that after that someone theorized Yukio might not need glasses anymore (for various reasons). But, if he's still gonna need them, well, he can't exactly "access" to his old "spares collection" in his dorm's room anymore, now can he? So, I think the reason Kato-sama drew that artwork could be that... she will not be drawing THOSE GLASSES anymore and that was actually a "goodbye" pic to them.

What if Yukio is still gonna need glasses and the Illuminati will provide him a new type? Like, a new design. Or, and I hope not, what if Yukio is gonna not only change glasses and uniform but... change style too? Like... his hair. I had this sudden thought and... I don't know how to feel about it! Bon and Shura (well, she didn't exacly do it on purpose) changed their hair style when they decided to "change" their life. So it looks like Kato-sama DOES like these kinda stuff. Argh. No, I don't even wanna think about it.

Why do I get an image of Saburota helpfully offering his glasses frames and Yukio punching him in the face. (Given how Yukio already strolled in and was like "Lucifer, you're full of shit", I am near 100% sure that the next time Yukio runs into Saburota, things will get violent fast.)

I had another thought at the bandage though. The more Yukio goes crazy, the more he seems to accumulate injuries. I  mean, he started fine, then he got a bandaged arm, then a bandaged eye. At this rate, he'll look like a mummy by the end of the manga! XD

But seriously, yeah, I am stoked for how Yukio's appearance will change. I'm sure he'll have glasses, because that's an integral part of his appearance. But otherwise? Hm...
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Offline Wikkelsoee

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #54 on: January 05, 2018, 08:22:30 AM »
^ Oh no, I just realised we need to use Toudou's first name when talking about him... Unless we all agree that Toudou is Saburota and Boss Lady is Homare?

And about Yukio's appearance: As long as he won't get emo hair (like covering his bad eye, lots of spikes) I'm in for almost everything.

Offline tandem

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #55 on: January 05, 2018, 09:52:09 AM »
^ I'll call him "old Toudou" to distinguish from "new Toudou" = boss lady

Why do I get an image of Saburota helpfully offering his glasses frames and Yukio punching him in the face. (Given how Yukio already strolled in and was like "Lucifer, you're full of shit", I am near 100% sure that the next time Yukio runs into Saburota, things will get violent fast.)
Because I still stick on my interpretation of the Toudou-Yukio relationship, I don't expect to see much interesting interaction in the future. Moreover, now it seems like old Toudou's words about Yukio were not too wrong, so I don't see why Yukio has to be angry. I think their remaining problem is that old Toudou once tried to kill Yukio, so Yukio might find some way to revenge for it.

^ The demon kings except for Samael. Mephisto knows what's going on and gives zero fucks. Probably because Satan is happy with him right now, since Samael is appearing to hold up his end of the bargain in training Rin so Rin's body can handle the flames. I wonder when Mephisto will break that agreement, because I'm pretty sure that he wants Rin as his own weapon to destroy Lucifer and Satan.
Mephiso doesn't have to do anything. What Satan gets is nothing more than a fake promise. Even after Rin's body becomes strong enough to endure the flame, who knows when will Satan has the chance to possess Rin? (Maybe after 20 years when Rin also has a son and he is yelled by his son.) Mephisto clearly has advantage in this deal.

(I don't think we are sure Mephisto intends to "destroy" Satan for it seems impossible to do that. He only need to prevent Satan from get a body. And I do believe there might be some mechanism that all demon kings can't directly disobey Satan)

Wait, does Satan say "That's an interesting woman..." after Shiemi gets kicked? If true, that foreshadowing makes me very uncomfortable... :o
Rather than after getting kicked, it's more after she told Yukio not to leave.

To me it sounded like a father-son conversation where the father is like "nice girl for you" (not for himself) and the son is like "don't get involved".
Though I like this headcanon, to me Satan's comment sounds more like "How amusing(
面白い) this weak girl thinks she can stop me"

My own headcanon is that Satan prefers mature woman.


In fact he has just broken Komaken without knowing what would happen to Rin. He doesn't know even if his brother could die bc of this, and instead of being worried he just joins the bad crew.
Satan broke Koumaken, not Yukio.
And he still doesn't mind if this kills Rin, he just takes off before knowing if he's okey.

He just shot his brother. It’s more like he expects him to recover.
Well he says : "I don't know what will happen when I go to the Illuminati. I might die too. In the unlikely event that (literally "a probability of one against ten thousand") we both survive, I will definitely become stronger than you."

So he knows Rin might die. If not from the broken sword, maybe from the order.

But Rin is surrounded by friends, leaving or staying might not make much of a difference in his chance of survival.

And he cares whether Rin survives or not. If he dies, who will he show off his strength to?

Oy vey. I could rationalize Yukio's "just die" from chapter 2 as an an expression of grief, since he kinda lost both his dad and his "human" brother in one night. But between this "yeah, you might die, I might as well, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make" and how Yukio has no visible reaction to Satan gleefully announces his plan to take Rin's body, I think it's safe to say that Yukio is completely disconnected from Rin. He doesn't feel a thing right now towards Rin, not love, not even anger. His regard for Rin is nothing but twisted shallow admiration.

But... I think this is how he really has felt for some time. And it explains a lot. His reactions to Rin have never struck me as someone close, but as someone estranged reacting to shadows.
Yes, the problem is not he wants Rin die or he doesn't save Rin, but it's that Yukio's reaction this chapter kind of an ultimate prove that Yukio doesn't feel Rin as a family member, but more like a competitor in a competition.

Although we shouldn't surprise since Yukio already shoot Rin last chapter and the hint was already there in chapter 2. Or it was also in the funeral scene in chapter 1 when Yukio just walked away. So far, Yukio's protection on Rin could only because he has promised Shiro.

:'( Sadly, weather or not Rin & Yukio both survive, I think it's way to late for any kind of reconciliation now that we know Yukio only really cares about power and knowledge for himself, that and being better than Rin. Katou wouldn't be able to do it without looking like she's pulling it out of thin air.

I still believe there will be reconciliation, kind of. Like said many times before, it'll be rough before that happens. 

Yeah, this is gonna be tough to repair but not impossible. Yukio's demeanor on the helicopter isn't that of someone comfortable with what they've done. More like someone rationalizing.
It depends on what a "reconciliation" or "happy ending" means. I think we will have an ending that Yukio apologize to everyone and stay as a good person, but he and Rin won't live together and won't be so close as before.

Contrasts with the Order keeping Rin on a tight leash. It'd be interesting to see what he does with that freedom. I kinda wonder if his adversarial nature will lead him to clash with orders. Somewhat ironic if their blind encouragement of his darker side leads him to rebel against them.
It could be that The Illuminati has flat organization hierarchy and people can freely talk to Lucifer with their own preferred style (Shima was also very casual in chapter 56). It makes sense if people join Illuminati because they hate bureaucracy of the Order.

Anyway, I believe Lucifer and other Illuminati members are aware the possibility that Yukio will against them (even if they didn't, they should know after the end of this chapter).

Offline Kittykat

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #56 on: January 05, 2018, 11:50:20 AM »


In fact he has just broken Komaken without knowing what would happen to Rin. He doesn't know even if his brother could die bc of this, and instead of being worried he just joins the bad crew.
Satan broke Koumaken, not Yukio.
And he still doesn't mind if this kills Rin, he just takes off before knowing if he's okey.

He just shot his brother. It’s more like he expects him to recover.
Well he says : "I don't know what will happen when I go to the Illuminati. I might die too. In the unlikely event that (literally "a probability of one against ten thousand") we both survive, I will definitely become stronger than you."

So he knows Rin might die. If not from the broken sword, maybe from the order.

But Rin is surrounded by friends, leaving or staying might not make much of a difference in his chance of survival.

And he cares whether Rin survives or not. If he dies, who will he show off his strength to?

Oy vey. I could rationalize Yukio's "just die" from chapter 2 as an an expression of grief, since he kinda lost both his dad and his "human" brother in one night. But between this "yeah, you might die, I might as well, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make" and how Yukio has no visible reaction to Satan gleefully announces his plan to take Rin's body, I think it's safe to say that Yukio is completely disconnected from Rin. He doesn't feel a thing right now towards Rin, not love, not even anger. His regard for Rin is nothing but twisted shallow admiration.

But... I think this is how he really has felt for some time. And it explains a lot. His reactions to Rin have never struck me as someone close, but as someone estranged reacting to shadows.
Yes, the problem is not he wants Rin die or he doesn't save Rin, but it's that Yukio's reaction this chapter kind of an ultimate prove that Yukio doesn't feel Rin as a family member, but more like a competitor in a competition.

Although we shouldn't surprise since Yukio already shoot Rin last chapter and the hint was already there in chapter 2. Or it was also in the funeral scene in chapter 1 when Yukio just walked away. So far, Yukio's protection on Rin could only because he has promised Shiro.

:'( Sadly, weather or not Rin & Yukio both survive, I think it's way to late for any kind of reconciliation now that we know Yukio only really cares about power and knowledge for himself, that and being better than Rin. Katou wouldn't be able to do it without looking like she's pulling it out of thin air.

I still believe there will be reconciliation, kind of. Like said many times before, it'll be rough before that happens. 

Yeah, this is gonna be tough to repair but not impossible. Yukio's demeanor on the helicopter isn't that of someone comfortable with what they've done. More like someone rationalizing.
It depends on what a "reconciliation" or "happy ending" means. I think we will have an ending that Yukio apologize to everyone and stay as a good person, but he and Rin won't live together and won't be so close as before.


I don't think they were close before. Yukio was disillusioned while Rin was comforted by an illusion (as Shiro was perpetuating the belief that he and everything was normal, and Yukio helped pretend because he was "protecting Rin"), so while Yukio disconnected from his brother, Rin was made to believe everything was ok. Now Rin is seeing they weren't as close as he thought since it's clicking that Yukio hasn't relied on him at all--that it's no longer the way it was when they were children. That's why the emphasis on the flashbacks how Yukio slaps Rin's hand away. To me, when the ending comes around, they'll actually be closer than before because the truth has been laid bare.

Offline Cloelia

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #57 on: January 05, 2018, 12:23:09 PM »
I think we will have an ending that Yukio apologize to everyone and stay as a good person, but he and Rin won't live together and won't be so close as before.

I could be wrong, but from my point of view, Yukio and Rin have never been THAT close to begin with (I'm talking about what we see in the manga from chapter 1). If they ever were, the only moment I can think of that's shown to us is chapter 2 flashback where Rin finds out Yukio wants to become a doctor, encourages him and we see the most (nah, scratch that, the -only-) genuine Yukio's smile out of this entire manga.

At the time, Yukio didn't react to Rin helping him. He didn't push him away. I guess this happened before Yukio started to feel frustrated over Rin helping him. But the moment he shoved Rin's hand away (and I think they were about 6 or 7 yrs old, right before or at the beginning of Yukio's training) was the moment any kind of close relationship they ever had started to crack.

And after that, it was just Yukio lying to Rin about his feels, the truths he knew, about literally everything. I want to blame Shiro (and I may be partially or completely wrong), so I'd say it was not by Yukio's free choice. But, from that point, their relationship was not "genuine" anymore. So if they ever WERE genuinely close, it didn't last that much and could prolly be considered just as pure brotherly affection of two very young siblings which has yet to determine their life route or even their true personalities/desires and so on.

So I kinda don't count that as "proof they've ever BEEN a -real- close couple of brothers". I repeat, at least for what concerns Yukio. But this is exactly the reason why I "like" to think (yeah, I'm trying to be really positive again) they may end up (by the end of the manga) ACTUALLY becoming close for the very first time. My idea of "development" (very rough and I know I'm wrong) it's: picking "something" and turning it into "something else" by the end of the story. Usually, the complete opposite of what it was at the beginning.

If Rin and Yukio were never actually that close from the start, a development could be having them challenge a lot of struggles which will turn them into close brothers by the end. Oc it'd take ages and a lot of work and so on. But, again, this is what I like to think/hope.


Edit:
I don't think they were close before. Yukio was disillusioned while Rin was comforted by an illusion (as Shiro was perpetuating the belief that he and everything was normal, and Yukio helped pretend because he was "protecting Rin"), so while Yukio disconnected from his brother, Rin was made to believe everything was ok. Now Rin is seeing they weren't as close as he thought since it's clicking that Yukio hasn't relied on him at all--that it's no longer the way it was when they were children. That's why the emphasis on the flashbacks how Yukio slaps Rin's hand away. To me, when the ending comes around, they'll actually be closer than before because the truth has been laid bare.

I read this after I posted my comment. Lol, we roughly thought the same thing (and I'm glad about it)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 12:27:27 PM by Cloelia »

Offline chinonamida

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #58 on: January 05, 2018, 03:05:03 PM »
Wait, does Satan say "That's an interesting woman..." after Shiemi gets kicked? If true, that foreshadowing makes me very uncomfortable... :o
Rather than after getting kicked, it's more after she told Yukio not to leave.

To me it sounded like a father-son conversation where the father is like "nice girl for you" (not for himself) and the son is like "don't get involved".
Though I like this headcanon, to me Satan's comment sounds more like "How amusing (面白い) this weak girl thinks she can stop me"
But he didn't say "面白い女だ" = "This is an interesting girl."
He said "面白い女がいる" = "(You) have an interesting woman" / "This is an interesting woman (you)'ve got there."
He also ends with "な"="hun?" to ask Yukio what he thinks and tease him too.
Even if he would have only said "面白い女だ", the "な" would have still made it sound like he's teasing Yukio since he's asking his opinion.

And Yukio's response is " ...... That's enough...!"
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 03:10:03 PM by chinonamida »

Offline tandem

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Re: Chapter 97 RAW
« Reply #59 on: January 05, 2018, 03:56:01 PM »
It depends on what a "reconciliation" or "happy ending" means. I think we will have an ending that Yukio apologize to everyone and stay as a good person, but he and Rin won't live together and won't be so close as before.


I don't think they were close before. Yukio was disillusioned while Rin was comforted by an illusion (as Shiro was perpetuating the belief that he and everything was normal, and Yukio helped pretend because he was "protecting Rin"), so while Yukio disconnected from his brother, Rin was made to believe everything was ok.
I think we will have an ending that Yukio apologize to everyone and stay as a good person, but he and Rin won't live together and won't be so close as before.

I could be wrong, but from my point of view, Yukio and Rin have never been THAT close to begin with (I'm talking about what we see in the manga from chapter 1).
Oh, I didn't mean mentally close. I know they are always like "WTF my brother is thinking" and even felt each other annoying. When I say "close" I literally mean they live together, Rin cook for Yukio and ask him when he will be home, or Yukio give Rin medicine when he is injured and reminds him about the hanging execution or not to rely on the flame too much.

One of the possible ending I imagine is that even after Yukio is back to the human side and both of them are exorcists and hence colleague, they avoid to meet each other and only communicate politely through their common friends (I mean the exwires) when necessary. I won't regard that as "closer" than they were. (Though that's still a happy end in my standard)

Wait, does Satan say "That's an interesting woman..." after Shiemi gets kicked? If true, that foreshadowing makes me very uncomfortable... :o
Rather than after getting kicked, it's more after she told Yukio not to leave.

To me it sounded like a father-son conversation where the father is like "nice girl for you" (not for himself) and the son is like "don't get involved".
Though I like this headcanon, to me Satan's comment sounds more like "How amusing (面白い) this weak girl thinks she can stop me"
But he didn't say "面白い女だ" = "This is an interesting girl."
He said "面白い女がいる" = "(You) have an interesting woman" / "This is an interesting woman (you)'ve got there."
He also ends with "な"="hun?" to ask Yukio what he thinks and tease him too.
Even if he would have only said "面白い女だ", the "な" would have still made it sound like he's teasing Yukio since he's asking his opinion.

And Yukio's response is " ...... That's enough...!"
Japanese is difficult ...

But could it be like Satan means something like "Don't you think (your friend/student) is an amusing girl?"

My problem is I don't see anything in Shiemi that Satan would find interesting to compliment her... and I feel Yukio's reaction is like he doesn't want Satan to notice Shiemi in any way