Author Topic: Chapter 49 discussion  (Read 55976 times)

Offline evenwiththerain

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #45 on: September 02, 2013, 09:59:08 PM »
I'm back! My sister is helping me translate now, so we should be faster! We're taking some liberties in the translation to make things make more sense, but if we change anything too drastic we'll throw in a translator's note.

the translations seem to be very ao no exorcist-y and it

and is Seraphim the big light birds name?

Offline Patty

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #46 on: September 02, 2013, 10:01:14 PM »
I wish we knew what their goal is.
It would make speculation so much easier.
Well, as I read some info (bosh, second time...) on wiki for inspiration: "Author Michael W. Ford has written on Lucifer as a "mask" of the Adversary, a motivator and illuminating force of the mind and subconscious."
"In ancient Canaanite mythology, the morning star is pictured as a god, Attar, who attempted to occupy the throne of Ba'al and, finding he was unable to do so, descended"
Anyway, Luciferianism represents the idea of ​​improving the earthly world in general...

As I remember, there was problem if it's 7 or 8 kings... Maybe Lucifer is stronger than Mephisto, but Mephisto didn't mention him as he could move out of Gehenna for good?
And it all would mean one thing... Lucifer has his own idea of world, seems he rebels against Satan...
" Haha, did you see daddy? I can open the gehenna gate too~"

Btw. I'm new here, so hi everyone~

Offline chaotickairos

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #47 on: September 02, 2013, 10:14:22 PM »
@evenwiththerain, it does seem like the bird is Seraphim.

I believe it is.

No Dialogue on page 10.
Page 11:
 Demon: How do you do everyone? I’m sorry to have to use this forceful voice. It’s very impolite, forgive me.
??: Is it the Seraphim’s voice?
Lightning: That voice! Is this guy the illuminati spy? (lightning’s dialogue is a bit confusing here. He says something along the lines of the demon being able to manifest around the world. And something about listening to him.)
Angel: What!?
 Lightning: No
Page 12:
Mephisto: I can’t believe it! We’re in the middle of preparing for a big event.
Lucifer: I am the Keimei Association Illuminati leader. (I don’t know what keimei means. Sorry.)  The King of Light, Lucifer.
Page 13:
Mephisto: Big Brother! (He uses a very respectful term here, as some forum members have already ntoed!) It’s been a while.  We haven’t met at home, hee hee hee…. Your mask is good. It suits you.
Lucifer: Samael.,,, You still look well. (I don’t really understand the nest sentence.)
Rin: What is he doing?
Lucifer (?) :  (This sentence is unclear, but he refers to Mephisto, calling him kagesama (shadow lord? He also refers to something as being fun. I think he’s still using keigo, which is throwing me off.) However, this time is like an errand? (Still unclear, but he also mentions the something being like a frontier. Possibly the city.)

Offline chaotickairos

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #48 on: September 02, 2013, 10:44:32 PM »
Okay, this is a really intense speech, that was very difficult to translate. However, it reveals the purpose of Lucifer and the Illuminati!

Page 14:
 Lucifer: We are the illuminati, this is the first stage, I came to proclaim it to you, the Order of the True Cross. (He is such a pain. He speaks really formally.) Today, it has been almost one year since our father, the Devil Satan’s revival. (I think this is what he’s saying. Now’s probably a good time to remind everyone we’re still amatures.)
Page 15:
Lucifer: And the two sides, Gehenna and Assiah, will become one in harmony. The nothing before light and dark will return. We will be liberated from suffering, and be similar, in harmony. We shall call upon (?) the truth’s harmony of the world.
Page 16:
Lucifer: The illuminati will not forgive things that deny this will. For the people who listen hard, I will open the door. Samael… Your older brother’s last request. My follower’s and mine…
Mephisto: Impossible!

Offline NeeNee

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #49 on: September 02, 2013, 10:59:59 PM »
well yukio surely doesnt feel special anymore, since rin has like 8 other brothers

This used to be my headcanon.

Quote
I wonder how many sons of Satan there are. Wouldn't it be funny if Rin was Nr. 137 or something?

"And here I was thinking I was special!" :-\

Offline evenwiththerain

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #50 on: September 03, 2013, 12:00:05 AM »
Okay, this is a really intense speech, that was very difficult to translate. However, it reveals the purpose of Lucifer and the Illuminati!


Lucifer: And the two sides, Gehenna and Assiah, will become one in harmony. The nothing before light and dark will return. We will be liberated from suffering, and be similar, in harmony. We shall call upon (?) the truth’s harmony of the world.


so he plans to bring both sides together, thinking it is the best solution to the suffering etc. sounds very connected to someone who is the king of light.
i mean, mephisto's 'impossible' must show how skeptical he is to the idea the illuminaty got going.

does it say what izumo's purpose exactly is? because shit, she must be very special to be kidnapped and getting everyone gathered there.

Offline NeeNee

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2013, 12:03:11 AM »
Btw. I'm new here, so hi everyone~

Hi there, Patty. :)


Lucifer: And the two sides, Gehenna and Assiah, will become one in harmony. The nothing before light and dark will return. We will be liberated from suffering, and be similar, in harmony. We shall call upon (?) the truth’s harmony of the world.

And there we have another something that reminds of the anime. *shudders*


Quote
Lucifer: The illuminati will not forgive things that deny this will. For the people who listen hard, I will open the door. Samael… Your older brother’s last request. My follower’s and mine…
Mephisto: Impossible!

He was pressuring Mephisto? Wow. This guy must have some serious power to get away with that.

Though I'm still confused where this older brother suddenly came from.

Offline MetallicArcher

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2013, 12:06:10 AM »
I will give what I understood (it's very little and I'm sure others already commented on it, but here it goes anyway):

Here Lighting says:

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セラフイム

serahuimu

Seraphim (I'm gonna roll with you guys here).

It being not a Japanese name/creature I am surprised it is written in kanji and not solely in katakana (sorry, but I fail at identifying the kanji, maybe someone can, whatever extra meaning Kazue chose for the word Seraphim might help us speculate).

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光 の 王 の 専属

hikari no ou no senzoku

Light/ray of king of subordinate.

Since I'm on it, this is how an actual seraphim looks like:

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Kazue certainly did her homework (I'm starting to suspect those months off weren't really off).

Mr. Mephy's big bro introduces himself to all the world (notice the Buddhist monks who are clearly standing outside a temple, I really hope that's not the Myo Dha):

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初めまして 皆さん

hajimemashite minasan

How are you? Glad to meet you all. (lol, he is being polite, I guess)

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私 は  [ はいめいはつしや] イリミナテイ の 総帥

watashi wa haimeihatsushiya iriminatei no sousui

I [not fucking clue of what that means] Illuminati of leader.

(notice watashi is gender neutral, do not discard Lucy being a girl yet).

Quote
光 の 王 ルシフエル です

hikari no ou rushifueru desu.

Light/ray of king Lucifer soy.

Is it me or he refers to Mephisto as Samael without any kind of honorific?

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So... the bird like thing covering his face is actually a mask? Notice the burns? around Lucy's neck, he is also wearing gloves and they aren't looking well either...

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Is it me or Mephy smirked when Lucy collapsed?

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Those things exploded all over the freaking world!!! Seriously, this is an attack against the entire Order...

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Can't tell if Arthur is angry of making a big effort (if it's the second, man, did the door really need to be that heavy? Wouldn't a smaller door work just the same?).

Also, the campus looks bad...

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About the demons flying around in the sky...

(click to show/hide)


Page 15:
Lucifer: And the two sides, Gehenna and Assiah, will become one in harmony. The nothing before light and dark will return. We will be liberated from suffering, and be similar, in harmony. We shall call upon (?) the truth’s harmony of the world.

Everytime I'm more convinced that this it how things originally were and that separating Assiah from Gehena was done to contain Satan's power.

On another note, so, Lucifer and Satan are going to be two different people... (me likes it).

Can I flash a little on why Rin's name means Lucifer?

What if, Lucifer is the only demon king who inherited Satan's flames?

What if "cake is a lie" and Rin is actually Lucifer's son? (Lucy seems able to not destroy his human host and, if he is a Demon King, may be a son of him could actually host Satan).

Or may be, when Rin was born, his mum/Satan/Mephisto/Fujimoto or whoever witnessed the birth was all like: "Oh, well, we can make Lucifers at Japan too".

Also, did Mephisto say something about Takara? I wonder what will be his justification to the Vatican about why he let the Illuminati take Izumo away...

Offline NeeNee

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2013, 12:12:46 AM »
So we have three brothers in three different camps now.

Yeah, it's not like this was complicated before.

Offline earthforge

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #54 on: September 03, 2013, 12:15:33 AM »
Though I'm still confused where this older brother suddenly came from.

There are Eight Demon kings. Two of them have announced that they are sibling to Rin. Is it really any surprise that another demon king shows up calling Rin and Mephisto "brother"?

Frankly, this just answers our question in the Eight Kings thread. We now know them all: King of Time, King of Water, King of Fire, King of Earth, King of Air/Spirits, King of Decay, King of Time and King of Light.

What I guess is that Lucy might be seeking a sufficient host (RUNNNNN YUKIO!).

But he's not so badly introduced. I don't think it's fair to compare him to Grandpa Asshat. Grandpa Asshat was just a dick for the hell of it. Lucy is similar to Mephisto. He's a chessmaster, albeit with way more vanity than Mephisto. Maybe he's foreseen some sort of common enemy and this is his way of fighting it off. Or maybe it is all a ruse just to blur the worlds so he can control more. Maybe he is seeking daddy approval. We don't know. But damn, from his actions, he's pretty darn awesome!

Sigh. The only downside is that we won't get any Toudou for 10 chapters at this rate. But Rin's character arc is finally beginning, and I'm more than happy with that.
"There are no answers. Only choices."

Offline NeeNee

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #55 on: September 03, 2013, 12:19:19 AM »
^ It doesn't solve the issue though. Mephisto said Amaimon was the lowest king and there were six above him, meaning seven in total. Adding an extra king on top just makes it more complicated.

Offline chaotickairos

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #56 on: September 03, 2013, 12:23:44 AM »
Okay, this is a really intense speech, that was very difficult to translate. However, it reveals the purpose of Lucifer and the Illuminati!


Lucifer: And the two sides, Gehenna and Assiah, will become one in harmony. The nothing before light and dark will return. We will be liberated from suffering, and be similar, in harmony. We shall call upon (?) the truth’s harmony of the world.


so he plans to bring both sides together, thinking it is the best solution to the suffering etc. sounds very connected to someone who is the king of light.
i mean, mephisto's 'impossible' must show how skeptical he is to the idea the illuminaty got going.

does it say what izumo's purpose exactly is? because shit, she must be very special to be kidnapped and getting everyone gathered there.

We should be getting to that in a few pages or so. For now, we're taking a break so I can deal with some college stuff. 

Offline earthforge

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #57 on: September 03, 2013, 12:40:21 AM »
^ It doesn't solve the issue though. Mephisto said Amaimon was the lowest king and there were six above him, meaning seven in total. Adding an extra king on top just makes it more complicated.

Nope. There were Eight Kings from the beginning, per Izumo's statement during the Fun Camp arc. Anything Mephisto said about his relative position in the order of the demon kings was subject to significant translation error.

We don't know if Lucy is weaker or stronger than Mephisto. We have no clear correlation that greater age means greater power. All we know is that Lucy is older.
"There are no answers. Only choices."

Offline chaotickairos

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #58 on: September 03, 2013, 01:52:49 AM »
And here we have it folk! The rest of the translation! Keep in mind we're not professionals, and are terrible at kansai dialect, and have difficulties with keigo. We did our best, so please enjoy!
Page 17: Mephisto: On top of a multitude of corpses, the living will creep about in a world of suffering, longing for the sky. Different things can exist together in chaos, I think the reason for that is harmony!
Lucifer: Why must we continue to exist, burdened by karma and suffering? This world is not as strong as you. It is filled with the weak.
 Mephisto: As I thought Brother, your values are wrong.
Lucifer: so it seems.
Page 18:
Lucifer: I don’t know what to think about you… I will try my best to hold back.
Ah yes, that girl shall receive/be given. She is essential to our plan. (My sister translates this as You’ll give me the girl.)
Page 19:
Lucifer: Ah. Excuse me.
Lady: Commander!
Lucifer: (I think he’s making coughing sounds. It’s possible he could be sick, or his host is failing him.)
Lady: Summon a doctor! And Shima Bastard, come!
Rin: Wait! What are you going to do with Izumo and Shima!
Page 20:
Rin: oi! Mephisto! Why are you just watching in silence? What’s your plan?
Mephisto: Beside the King of Light, I cannot do anything. I am weak, and that side’s essence is Gehenna’s strongest. What is your sense?
Rin: Then…
Yukio: Nii-san?!
Rin: I’ll stop him!
Page 20:
Lady: Go.
Rin: Shima…
Shima: Okumura-kun.
I have one warning.
After the murder of humans, the resolution will prevail (?) The illuminati will gather people. (I’m having trouble with this whole sentence.)
Page 22:
Bon: What kind of joke is this, Shima? Come back!
Page 23:
Shima: Until now, thank you for trusting me everyone! However, It ended like this. See ya!
Page 24:
Bon:  I cannot accept that you’d abandon zerifu(? It’s in katakana, but I don’t know what it is.)
Konekomaru: Bon…
Bon: Shima! … RENZOU!
Page 25:
Lady: Poor training… No one’s gonna nurse you!
Mephisto: Ahh, this is a proclamation of war. It’s over. There is no reason/ it’s simple.
Page 26-27 no dialogue.
Page 28:
Shura: AAHHH
Angel: Grigori!
Angel??(it might not be him): (something about the lottery and starting out)


Page 29: The main barrier was just now destroyed by the King of Light. The barrier also suffered damage in the Seraphim’s explosion. Look.
Yukio: Lower class… no, middle class demons are gathering and coming!
Page: 30
Mephisto: Braches around the world be in the same state of confusion. I should go and try to pick up the pieces of the Japan Branch. Yukio Okumura!
Yukio: Yes!
 Mephisto: I want you to lead the Exwires, and rescue Izumo Kamiki.
Yukio: Only me and the Exwires?
Page 31:
MephistoL Naturally we’d come to this conculsion. Reinforcements will be sent. We’ll keep an eye on Takara Nemu-kun. What does he say about that?
He is my student supervisor. I brought him from outside the exorcists.
Everyone: Huh?
Mephisto: He is the holder of upper first class power, so relax.
Someone: And Shima?
Page 32:
Mephisto: I have not investigated Shima-kun much. I do not have an excuse.
However, for now, it’s a shame. The reality is that he’s an Illuminati  rat…
Rin: You’re annoying. Shut up, clown!
Page 33:
Rin: I’ve decided, we’re definitely going to get Izumo and Shima back!





Wow, what a chapter!



Offline MetallicArcher

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Re: Chapter 49 (RAW) discussion - SPOILERS!
« Reply #59 on: September 03, 2013, 02:38:56 AM »
Quote
Mephisto: I want you to lead the Exwires, and rescue Izumo Kamiki.
Yukio: Only me and the Exwires?

Mephisto: Naturally we’d come to this conclusion. Reinforcements will be sent. We’ll keep an eye on Takara Nemu-kun. What does he say about that?
He is my student supervisor. I brought him from outside the exorcists.
Everyone: Huh?
Mephisto: He is the holder of upper first class power, so relax.

They are off to rescue Izumo? Takara will get to show his powers? We will learn what's up with the puppet?



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